{"podcast":{"title":"More or Less","slug":"more-or-less-6425141","podcast_index_feed_id":6425141,"rss_url":"https://anchor.fm/s/e3c9ef30/podcast/rss","website_url":"https://moreorlesspod.com/","image_url":"https://d3t3ozftmdmh3i.cloudfront.net/staging/podcast_uploaded_nologo/38116620/38116620-1716176683266-60ee7e22a9d27.jpg","author":"Dave Morin, Jessica Lessin, Brit Morin, and Sam Lessin","episode_count":159,"summary":"Dave Morin, Jessica Lessin, Brit Morin, and Sam Lessin have debated the future of Silicon Valley and tech as the closest of friends for the last 15 years. Now six companies, two venture funds and more than a decade at Google, Apple and Facebook later, they are opening up the debate. From The Information, Offline Ventures, and Slow Ventures. Follow the crew: http://x.com/davemorin http://x.com/brit http://x.com/lessin http:/x.com/jessicalessin Follow the pod: https://moreorlesspod.com/ http://youtube.com/moreorlesspod https://x.com/moreorlesspod","last_synced_at":"2026-07-10T22:17:30.049171+00:00","page_url":"https://stenobird.com/podcast/more-or-less-6425141"},"episode":{"title":"Apple, OpenAI & Why Nobody Makes Money in AI | The SaaS Apocalypse","slug":"apple-openai-why-nobody-makes-money-in-ai-the-saas-apocalypse","published_at":"2026-02-27T17:00:00+00:00","page_url":"https://stenobird.com/podcast/more-or-less-6425141/apple-openai-why-nobody-makes-money-in-ai-the-saas-apocalypse","show_page_url":"https://stenobird.com/podcast/more-or-less-6425141","url":"https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/moreorlesspod/episodes/Apple--OpenAI--Why-Nobody-Makes-Money-in-AI--The-SaaS-Apocalypse-e3flvg0","audio_url":"https://anchor.fm/s/e3c9ef30/podcast/play/116112320/https%3A%2F%2Fd3ctxlq1ktw2nl.cloudfront.net%2Fstaging%2F2026-1-27%2F418914814-44100-2-ddf9680092124.mp3","summary":"Starting with a mini celebration: Dave defends his ski racing crown, before Sam declares software dead and capitalism broken. Even among GPs at Upfront Summit, the mood is uncertain: nobody knows whether to invest in software anymore, and many are quietly struggling to raise.The debate heats up over whether AI will democratize software creation or just accelerate capitalism's race to zero margins. Sam argues that when intelligence becomes abundant, it becomes worthless, making the entire AI industry, and by extension Silicon Valley, "pretty bad business." Dave counters that we're about to see a Cambrian explosion of software creators, finally giving billions of people agency over their digital lives.Plus: whether Stripe should buy PayPal during this opportunistic Trump-administration window, Gen Z panic-buying original iPods, Sam's shitposting-to-funding pipeline, and whether OnlyFans has the best KYC in fintech Chapters: 7:24 - Upfront Summit: Where Are All the LPs? 10:49 - Are VCs Still Investing in Software? 12:04 - Slow Ventures Going Contrarian: Investing While Others Freeze 13:27 - When Intelligence Goes to Zero: Why AI is Bad Business 15:53 - Polsia: $100K to $700K ARR in One Week (AI Agents Only) 19:39 - Capitalism's Black Hole: AI Makes Markets Too Efficient 25:00 - Creator Fund Thesis: Investing in Cults, Not Content 28:20 - Who Makes Money When Margins Hit Zero? 34:41 - Silicon Valley's Advantage is DEAD (The Magic Wizard Hat) 37:35 - Who Should Buy PayPal? (Stripe's One-Shot Window) 42:11 - Agentic Commerce: Do Payment Networks Even Matter? 45:18 - OpenAI Smart Speaker: Eddie Cue's Son Working on It 46:51 - Gen Z Buying Original iPods: The Analog Rebellion We’re also on ↓ X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspod Instagram: https://instagram.com/moreor…","meta_description":"Starting with a mini celebration: Dave defends his ski racing crown, before Sam declares software dead and capitalism broken. Even among GPs at Upfront Su…","key_points":[],"chapters":[],"topics":[],"duration_seconds":2853,"processing_state":"not_requested","actions":[{"name":"request_transcript","method":"POST","url":"https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/more-or-less-6425141/episodes/apple-openai-why-nobody-makes-money-in-ai-the-saas-apocalypse/transcription-requests","description":"Idempotently request low-priority transcript generation for this episode."},{"name":"read_markdown","method":"GET","url":"https://stenobird.com/podcast/more-or-less-6425141/apple-openai-why-nobody-makes-money-in-ai-the-saas-apocalypse.md","description":"Read the agent-friendly Markdown representation of this episode resource."}]}}