# 451. Do Not Become Addicted to Electrons (ft. Tim Sahay, Kate Mackenzie)

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/this-machine-kills-428599/451-do-not-become-addicted-to-electrons-ft-tim-sahay-kate-mackenzie
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/this-machine-kills-428599/451-do-not-become-addicted-to-electrons-ft-tim-sahay-kate-mackenzie.md
Podcast: [This Machine Kills](https://stenobird.com/podcast/this-machine-kills-428599)
Published: 2026-04-01T22:43:53+00:00
Episode link: https://soundcloud.com/thismachinekillspod/451-do-not-become-addicted-to
Audio file: https://feeds.soundcloud.com/stream/2294891783-thismachinekillspod-451-do-not-become-addicted-to.mp3
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JSON: https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/this-machine-kills-428599/episodes/451-do-not-become-addicted-to-electrons-ft-tim-sahay-kate-mackenzie
Duration seconds: 4731

## Resource

We chat with Tim Sahay and Kate Mackenzie — authors of the indispensable newsletter The Polycrisis and hosts of the new podcast Electric World Order — to get into the energy transition, financial markets, fossil fuel disruptions, and the war in Iran. Much of the coverage about the current oil crisis and chokepoint in the Strait of Hormuz is focused on the impacts of supply shocks, but equally important are the long-term effects of demand destruction. We lay out what an energy transition under conditions of polycrisis actually entails: things don’t just smoothly change while staying the same, instead it’s more like a material shift in the centre of political, economic, energetic power: from the petrostate (e.g. USA) to the electrostate (e.g. China). ••• The Polycrisis | Phenomenal World https://www.phenomenalworld.org/series/the-polycrisis/ ••• Trailer for Electric World Order | | The Polycrisis Podcast https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/introducing-electric-world-order-the-geopolitics/id1884213852?i=1000754959853 Standing Plugs: ••• Order Jathan’s book: https://www.ucpress.edu/book/9780520398078/the-mechanic-and-the-luddite ••• Subscribe to Ed’s substack: https://substack.com/@thetechbubble ••• Subscribe to TMK on patreon for premium episodes: https://www.patreon.com/thismachinekills Hosted by Jathan Sadowski (bsky.app/profile/jathansadowski.com) and Edward Ongweso Jr. (www.x.com/bigblackjacobin). Production / Music by Jereme Brown (bsky.app/profile/jebr.bsky.social)

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## Transcript

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