# Drone masters – How Ukraine reinvented modern warfare

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/this-is-not-a-drill-with-gavin-esler-4458337/drone-masters-how-ukraine-reinvented-modern-warfare
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/this-is-not-a-drill-with-gavin-esler-4458337/drone-masters-how-ukraine-reinvented-modern-warfare.md
Podcast: [This Is Not A Drill with Gavin Esler](https://stenobird.com/podcast/this-is-not-a-drill-with-gavin-esler-4458337)
Published: 2026-05-14T03:00:00+00:00
Episode link: https://pscrb.fm/rss/p/traffic.megaphone.fm/NSR8806144350.mp3
Audio file: https://pscrb.fm/rss/p/traffic.megaphone.fm/NSR8806144350.mp3
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JSON: https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/this-is-not-a-drill-with-gavin-esler-4458337/episodes/drone-masters-how-ukraine-reinvented-modern-warfare
Duration seconds: 2223

## Resource

Putin thought that Ukraine would quickly fold under a massively superior Russian onslaught. Instead, the War has seen Ukraine reinventing itself as a world expert in drone warfare, exploiting cheap replaceable tech and digital networks to strike deep and painfully into Russia. Ukraine now leads the world in the air defence expertise required in today’s conflict zones – and nations across Europe and the Middle East now consult Ukraine on the fast-evolving drone tech they need in today’s unstable world. Can Kyiv use drones to gain a significant advantage in the war? And what will it mean for future conflicts, the ethics of war, and international security? Oz Katerji looks at the new frontier of battlefield tech with journalist and associate research fellow at the Henry Jackson Society, David Kirichenko. • Support us on Patreon to keep This Is Not A Drill producing thought-provoking podcasts like this. Written and presented by Oz Katerji. Produced by Robin Leeburn. Original theme music by Paul Hartnoll – https://www.orbitalofficial.com. Executive Producer Martin Bojtos. Managing Editor Jacob Jarvis. Group Editor Andrew Harrison. This Is Not A Drill is a Podmasters production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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## Transcript

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