# #13 - Cassie Hugill: Breaking barriers and trusting your gut in leadership

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/the-whole-truth-leadership-stories-with-sarah-perugia-7098484/13-cassie-hugill-breaking-barriers-and-trusting-your-gut-in-leadership
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/the-whole-truth-leadership-stories-with-sarah-perugia-7098484/13-cassie-hugill-breaking-barriers-and-trusting-your-gut-in-leadership.md
Podcast: [The Whole Truth: Leadership Stories with Sarah Perugia](https://stenobird.com/podcast/the-whole-truth-leadership-stories-with-sarah-perugia-7098484)
Published: 2026-04-07T08:00:00+00:00
Episode link: https://www.sarahperugia.com/
Audio file: https://episodes.captivate.fm/episode/e1c87a7e-1418-48a6-90c9-820630eadb78.mp3
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Duration seconds: 2129

## Resource

Cassie Hugill is the CEO of the Martingale Foundation, an organisation dedicated to breaking down barriers to postgraduate study for talented students, no matter their background. With a career she describes as “squiggly,” Cassie’s journey has taken her from a small country town in Australia to a senior leadership role at UCL, and now to leading a foundation making a real difference in the UK research sector. In this episode, Cassie shares her insights on navigating leadership as a relatively young female CEO, the delicate balance between ambition and perception, and why trusting your gut is often the best guide. She also unpacks the concept of the “hidden curriculum” in education, offers her philosophy on failing forward, and reflects on how unconventional career paths can lead to extraordinary impact. In this episode, we talk about: 00:00 – Introduction to Cassie and the Martingale Foundation 00:46 – Becoming a young CEO on a non-linear path 02:28 – Stepping into leadership and finding her voice 04:50 – Purpose, background, and a love of research 08:10 – Creating Into Research and the path to Martingale 12:29 – Martingale’s impact and future growth 14:52 – Comparing the UK and Australian education systems 18:38 – Embracing a squiggly career path 21:40 – Saying yes and learning from unusual roles 25:55 – Redefining failure and leading with confidence 26:31 – Bias, being “too much,” and owning the CEO role 29:33 – Advice to her younger self: ambition without burnout Cassie’s story is a brilliant reminder that leadership doesn’t have to follow a straight path. If you’ve ever felt like you don't fit the traditional mould, or want to embrace your own unique journey, this conversation is full of practical wisdom, inspiration, and encouragement to lead with confidence and a…

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