# 153: Returning to the Wasteland with Jan Willem Nijman, Joonas Turner, and Jukio Kallio (Nuclear Throne)

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/the-secret-lives-of-games-439116/153-returning-to-the-wasteland-with-jan-willem-nijman-joonas-turner-and-jukio-kallio-nuclear-throne
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/the-secret-lives-of-games-439116/153-returning-to-the-wasteland-with-jan-willem-nijman-joonas-turner-and-jukio-kallio-nuclear-throne.md
Podcast: [The Secret Lives of Games](https://stenobird.com/podcast/the-secret-lives-of-games-439116)
Published: 2026-03-06T14:40:00+00:00
Episode link: https://eggplant.show/153-returning-to-the-wasteland-with-jan-willem-nijman-joonas-turner-and-jukio-kallio-nuclear-throne
Audio file: https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/thespelunkyshowlike/TSLOG_153__Nuclear_Throne.mp3?dest-id=790494
Processing state: processed
JSON: https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/the-secret-lives-of-games-439116/episodes/153-returning-to-the-wasteland-with-jan-willem-nijman-joonas-turner-and-jukio-kallio-nuclear-throne
Duration seconds: 6754

## Resource

Rob and Zach chat with Joonas Turner (Downwell, Noita, Cult of the Lamb), Jukio Kallio (Fall Guys, Minit, Dave the Diver), and Jan Willem "JW" Nijman (Super Crate Box, Ridiculous Fishing, Minit) about their landmark twin-stick wasteland shooter, Nuclear Throne, and its recent blowout 10th anniversary update. They discuss reopening a project after a decade, balancing through play, the decision to not implement traditional invincibility frames, the shifting culture of what makes a design "engaging," and more! Audio edited by Dylan Shumway Discussed in this episode: Nuclear Throne https://nuclearthrone.com/ Controls You Can Feel: Putting Tactility Back Into Touch Controls https://youtu.be/OIOitNx9RHI?si=vcV3GCcsiy1W4Efr Spelunky https://www.spelunkyworld.com/ Shoot First https://www.indiedb.com/games/shoot-first Crimsonland https://www.crimsonland.com/ Downwell https://downwellgame.com/ Tormentor x Punisher https://tormentorxpunisher.com/ PAPERHEAD https://store.steampowered.com/app/2680280/PAPERHEAD/ Jukio's Bandcamp https://jukiokallio.bandcamp.com/ https://secretlives.games https://discord.gg/tslog https://www.patreon.com/tslog

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