# Podcast for Social Research, Episode 87: Deviant Matter

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Podcast: [The Podcast for Social Research](https://stenobird.com/podcast/the-podcast-for-social-research-1078639)
Published: 2025-04-03T21:24:00+00:00
Episode link: https://thebrooklyninstitute.libsyn.com/podcast-for-social-research-episode-87-deviant-matter-a-conversation-with-kyla-wazana-tompkins
Audio file: https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/thebrooklyninstitute/Podcast_for_Social_Research_EP.87_Deviant_Matter.mp3?dest-id=85319
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Duration seconds: 5425

## Resource

In episode 87 of the Podcast for Social Research, recorded live at BISR Central, BISR's Rebecca Ariel Porte and Dilettante Army Editor-in-Chief Sara Clugage sat down with Kyla Wazana Tompkins to discuss her latest book, Deviant Matter: Ferment, Intoxicants, Jelly, Rot. The conversation touches on, among other things: food and the early history of the War on Drugs, the racialization of sugar, jelly and cocaine, food as a means for diagnosing entrenched political problems, and how plantation capitalism—and later, industrial capitalism—altered the sensory quality of everyday life. Along the way, they ask: what are the political uses of disgust? How have coffee, rum and sugar production transformed human experience? And—with Sylvia Wynter—how do we reconcile the immateriality of ideology with the materiality of the body? The Podcast for Social Research is produced by Ryan Lentini. Learn more about upcoming courses on our website . Follow Brooklyn Institute for Social Research on Twitter / Facebook / Instagram / Bluesky

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## Transcript

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