# Massimo Pigliucci on Doubt, Moral Courage, and Living Without Illusions

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Podcast: [The Michael Shermer Show](https://stenobird.com/podcast/the-michael-shermer-show-444422)
Published: 2026-06-20T16:00:00+00:00
Episode link: https://dts.podtrac.com/redirect.mp3/pscrb.fm/rss/p/traffic.libsyn.com/sciencesalon/mss620_Massimo_Pigliucci_2026_06_20.mp3
Audio file: https://dts.podtrac.com/redirect.mp3/pscrb.fm/rss/p/traffic.libsyn.com/secure/sciencesalon/mss620_Massimo_Pigliucci_2026_06_20.mp3?dest-id=513978
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Duration seconds: 5635

## Resource

What does it mean to live well when certainty is unavailable? Michael Shermer speaks with Massimo Pigliucci about moral character, ancient philosophy, and the difficult art of making decisions without easy answers. The conversation moves from Cicero and Stoicism to the legacy of the New Atheism, asking why rejecting religion is not the same as having a philosophy of life. They discuss virtue ethics, moral dilemmas, effective altruism, faith, free will, democracy, human flourishing, and the uneasy relationship between facts and values. From the trolley problem and Peter Singer's drowning child thought experiment to the ethics of charity, the limits of utilitarian thinking, and the dangers of tribalism, this episode asks how we should act when rules fail, consequences are uncertain, and good intentions are not enough. Massimo Pigliucci is a bestselling author, philosopher, evolutionary biologist, and the K.D. Irani Professor of Philosophy at the City College of New York. His work spans evolutionary biology, philosophy of science, pseudoscience, and practical philosophy. His latest book is How to Be a Happy Skeptic: The Power of Doubt in a Meaningful Life .

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## Transcript

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