# Why Spirituality Is a Founder's Edge, Not a Distraction

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/the-heart-of-entrepreneurship-7083654/why-spirituality-is-a-founder-s-edge-not-a-distraction
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/the-heart-of-entrepreneurship-7083654/why-spirituality-is-a-founder-s-edge-not-a-distraction.md
Podcast: [The Heart of Entrepreneurship](https://stenobird.com/podcast/the-heart-of-entrepreneurship-7083654)
Published: 2026-07-29T09:51:23+00:00
Episode link: https://share.transistor.fm/s/2a5dbe90
Audio file: https://media.transistor.fm/2a5dbe90/40657813.mp3
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JSON: https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/the-heart-of-entrepreneurship-7083654/episodes/why-spirituality-is-a-founder-s-edge-not-a-distraction
Duration seconds: 3056

## Resource

Can you explore spirituality and still build a scaling, successful company? In this episode, Dave Kashen and Jesse Pujji take on the fear that drive and awakening pull in opposite directions, and make the case that they reinforce each other. They start concrete with what founders can and can't control (sorting the files, why you can't control the outcome but can control whether you believe your thoughts), then move into the deeper work: letting go of resisting reality, the unfindability of the self, and what it means to lead from awareness instead of a self that always needs defending. The throughline is that none of this runs on belief. It runs on direct experience, and the less defended you are, the easier it becomes to create what you want. Along the way: the train of thoughts, awareness as the sky, the hard problem of consciousness, moths flying into streetlights, and the movie of your life where you're also the screenwriter.

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## Transcript

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