# Learning to live less from the mind and more from the hara. Oct 14, 1981

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/talks-by-zen-roshi-lola-mcdowell-lee-6423598/learning-to-live-less-from-the-mind-and-more-from-the-hara-oct-14-1981
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/talks-by-zen-roshi-lola-mcdowell-lee-6423598/learning-to-live-less-from-the-mind-and-more-from-the-hara-oct-14-1981.md
Podcast: [Talks by Zen Roshi, Lola McDowell Lee](https://stenobird.com/podcast/talks-by-zen-roshi-lola-mcdowell-lee-6423598)
Published: 2026-01-16T21:27:12+00:00
Episode link: https://rss.com/podcasts/ing-publishing/2434925
Audio file: https://content.rss.com/episodes/214545/2434925/ing-publishing/2026_01_16_20_02_46_41e83dba-5543-44fe-acab-53897cf23b13.mp3
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JSON: https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/talks-by-zen-roshi-lola-mcdowell-lee-6423598/episodes/learning-to-live-less-from-the-mind-and-more-from-the-hara-oct-14-1981
Duration seconds: 3500

## Resource

(Note: This recording contains a static hum that, in spite of efforts to remove, does remain somewhat. But the content of the talk might be worth overlooking). Zen Roshi, Lola McDowell Lee, understands how odd it must sound to some that an individual human being can become one with the universe. She explains that this search for unity is often misguided because people look out there for something that can only be found in the immediate present. This issue begins with our own internal division. The split between spirit and body, or matter and consciousness. If a person is divided within themselves, they cannot possibly perceive existence as a unified whole. Only an individual who has achieved internal integration can truly know that existence is indivisible. This internal division is not innate but learned. An infant is born in a state of natural integration, unaware of any separation between body, mind, soul, or even between self and mother. However, the necessities of survival, societal conditioning, and the need for security force the growing child to begin to discriminate. Lola explains how we are taught to identify with the upper part of the body (the intellect and head) while viewing the lower part (instincts and feelings) as inferior or shameful. This preference for the intellect causes blockages, leaving us constantly struggling to control our thoughts and creating a life defined by inner conflict. Lola suggests we try switching it up: a re-awakening of sensitivity. The intellect has no direct access to the world and is entirely dependent on the senses. When we lose touch with our physical senses, our intellect becomes uninformed and life loses its magic. Try to bypass thinking that the flower is beautiful and instead focus on what the senses are actually report…

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