# Clean Out the Freezers (In Defense of Virology - Episode 4)

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/science-from-the-fringe-7022876/clean-out-the-freezers-in-defense-of-virology-episode-4
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/science-from-the-fringe-7022876/clean-out-the-freezers-in-defense-of-virology-episode-4.md
Podcast: [Science From the Fringe](https://stenobird.com/podcast/science-from-the-fringe-7022876)
Published: 2025-12-09T13:00:00+00:00
Episode link: https://sciencefromthefringe.substack.com/p/in-defense-of-virology-featuring-18f
Audio file: https://api.substack.com/feed/podcast/181100933/4c4318c3419bb2a61db091a98182473a.mp3
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JSON: https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/science-from-the-fringe-7022876/episodes/clean-out-the-freezers-in-defense-of-virology-episode-4
Duration seconds: 2704

## Resource

In the fourth episode of In Defense of Virology , Rutgers Professor and Science From the Fringe host Bryce Nickels and distinguished virologist Simon Wain-Hobson argue that labs should destroy frozen stocks of dangerous, nonessential pathogens produced through gain-of-function research or historical resurrection—simple to do, high-impact for reducing global risk. Simon highlights precedent—from post-eradication smallpox and rinderpest —and cites a recent Newcastle disease virus re-emergence in China strongly suggestive of a freezer escape . Given that even top labs leak, he argues, destruction of unnecessary stocks is common-sense risk reduction. The episode concludes with an overlooked puzzle: despite SARS-CoV-2’s devastating impact, fewer than 100 related genomes have been disclosed, compared to more than 240 for SARS-1. Whether due to undersampling or undisclosed sequences, Simon contends the gap is a public-health failure—surveillance is essential, but must not be confused with the risky manipulation that helped create today’s biosafety crisis. Virology must decide between continued high-risk work and responsibly “cleaning house.” (recorded November 22, 2025) Get full access to Science From the Fringe at sciencefromthefringe.substack.com/subscribe

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