# 3564: The 4% Rule and Why We're Not Relying on It by Kiersten Saunders of Rich and Regular on Flexible Retirement

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/optimal-finance-daily-financial-independence-and-money-advice-879660/3564-the-4-rule-and-why-we-re-not-relying-on-it-by-kiersten-saunders-of-rich-and-regular-on-flexible-retirement
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/optimal-finance-daily-financial-independence-and-money-advice-879660/3564-the-4-rule-and-why-we-re-not-relying-on-it-by-kiersten-saunders-of-rich-and-regular-on-flexible-retirement.md
Podcast: [Optimal Finance Daily - Financial Independence and Money Advice](https://stenobird.com/podcast/optimal-finance-daily-financial-independence-and-money-advice-879660)
Published: 2026-05-18T07:00:00+00:00
Episode link: https://traffic.megaphone.fm/OLD7652288591.mp3?updated=1778525302
Audio file: https://traffic.megaphone.fm/OLD7652288591.mp3?updated=1778525302
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JSON: https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/optimal-finance-daily-financial-independence-and-money-advice-879660/episodes/3564-the-4-rule-and-why-we-re-not-relying-on-it-by-kiersten-saunders-of-rich-and-regular-on-flexible-retirement
Duration seconds: 670

## Resource

Discover all of the podcasts in our network, search for specific episodes, get the Optimal Living Daily workbook, and learn more at: OLDPodcast.com. Episode 3564: Kiersten Saunders explores the 4% rule as a framework for achieving financial independence by living below your means, investing wisely, and creating enough wealth to live off investment growth. She also shares why relying solely on stock portfolios isn’t enough for her family, outlining a strategy built around real estate and multiple income streams to create more freedom, flexibility, and control over time. Read along with the original article(s) here: https://richandregular.com/the-4-rule-and-why-were-not-relying-on-it/ Quotes to ponder: "I define financial independence as the “breakeven point” of life, or the point where your fixed cost of living is covered." "IF you are in a position to explore alternative ways of earning income and are interested in owning more of your time, you should consider this approach of “front-loading” your retirement." "A well balanced, cost effective portfolio can withstand an annual withdrawal of 4% into perpetuity." Episode references: Financial Independence Retire Early (FIRE): https://www.investopedia.com/terms/f/financial-independence-retire-early-fire.asp S&P 500: https://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/sp500.asp Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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