# NATO's Terrible Mistake: Proxy-War Turns Against Europe | Anatol Lieven

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/neutrality-studies-7179578/nato-s-terrible-mistake-proxy-war-turns-against-europe-anatol-lieven
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/neutrality-studies-7179578/nato-s-terrible-mistake-proxy-war-turns-against-europe-anatol-lieven.md
Podcast: [Neutrality Studies](https://stenobird.com/podcast/neutrality-studies-7179578)
Published: 2026-08-17T01:03:12+00:00
Episode link: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/neutrality-studies/episodes/NATOs-Terrible-Mistake-Proxy-War-Turns-Against-Europe--Anatol-Lieven-e3ng9ih
Audio file: https://traffic.megaphone.fm/APO8843615427.mp3
Processing state: not_requested
JSON: https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/neutrality-studies-7179578/episodes/nato-s-terrible-mistake-proxy-war-turns-against-europe-anatol-lieven
Duration seconds: 2629

## Resource

NATO's European Forever War is now turning decisively against the EU. The elites that have been cheering the carnage on for the longest time are starting to catch up with the actual battle field reality.Anatol Lieven, director of the Eurasia Program at the Quincy Institute, discusses why Ukraine’s NATO question and territorial deadlock make a lasting settlement hard. He examines US weapons limits, the Iran war, changes in US and Israeli politics, Morocco’s role in the Ceuta migration crisis, and why China is avoiding a move on Taiwan. He also argues that Western foreign-policy institutions repeatedly fail to learn from past wars.Links:Anatol Lieven at Responsible Statecraft: https://responsiblestatecraft.org/aut... Neutrality Studies substack: https://pascallottaz.substack.com Merch: https://neutralitystudies.com/shop Donation: https://neutralitystudies.com/donate Timestamps: 00:00 Ukraine, NATO, and peace talks 07:46 Can a Ukraine deal hold? 16:51 US weapons limits and Iran 21:15 Trump’s Iran strategy 25:13 Israel and US political shifts 28:31 Ceuta migration crisis 33:40 China, Taiwan, and Western failures

## Actions

- request_transcript: `POST https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/neutrality-studies-7179578/episodes/nato-s-terrible-mistake-proxy-war-turns-against-europe-anatol-lieven/transcription-requests` — Idempotently request low-priority transcript generation for this episode.
- read_markdown: `GET https://stenobird.com/podcast/neutrality-studies-7179578/nato-s-terrible-mistake-proxy-war-turns-against-europe-anatol-lieven.md` — Read the agent-friendly Markdown representation of this episode resource.

A page view does not enqueue transcription. Agents should invoke `request_transcript` explicitly when they need this episode processed.

## Transcript

Full transcripts are not published on public pages unless there is a clear rights basis.