# Sebastian Mallaby: The Ghost in the Machine

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/impolitic-with-john-heilemann-1329107/sebastian-mallaby-the-ghost-in-the-machine
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/impolitic-with-john-heilemann-1329107/sebastian-mallaby-the-ghost-in-the-machine.md
Podcast: [Impolitic with John Heilemann](https://stenobird.com/podcast/impolitic-with-john-heilemann-1329107)
Published: 2026-04-20T16:11:00+00:00
Episode link: https://tracking.swap.fm/track/v9Uiw3bGr54f6BVZKSyc/pscrb.fm/rss/p/traffic.megaphone.fm/CAD4785903097.mp3?updated=1776701941
Audio file: https://tracking.swap.fm/track/v9Uiw3bGr54f6BVZKSyc/pscrb.fm/rss/p/traffic.megaphone.fm/CAD4785903097.mp3?updated=1776701941
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JSON: https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/impolitic-with-john-heilemann-1329107/episodes/sebastian-mallaby-the-ghost-in-the-machine
Duration seconds: 4788

## Resource

John welcomes author Sebastian Mallaby to discuss his new bestselling book, “The Infinity Machine: Demis Hassabis, DeepMind, and the Quest for Superintelligence.” Mallaby explains why Hassabis, the leader of Google’s efforts in artificial intelligence, remains an obscure and under-covered figure compared with Sam Altman, Dario Amodei, and Elon Musk, the poster boys of the A.I. revolution; why, despite his relative public obscurity, Hassabis may prove more important in shaping our future than any of them; and whether he is, at bottom, the kind of person we should comfortable entrusting with such power. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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## Transcript

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