# Dead as a Dodo? Maybe Not! Colossal's Beth Shapiro on the Science of De-Extinction — and Moonshots

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/future-around-find-out-5737933/dead-as-a-dodo-maybe-not-colossal-s-beth-shapiro-on-the-science-of-de-extinction-and-moonshots
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/future-around-find-out-5737933/dead-as-a-dodo-maybe-not-colossal-s-beth-shapiro-on-the-science-of-de-extinction-and-moonshots.md
Podcast: [Future Around & Find Out](https://stenobird.com/podcast/future-around-find-out-5737933)
Published: 2026-03-03T10:00:00+00:00
Episode link: https://share.transistor.fm/s/23a4a1fd
Audio file: https://media.transistor.fm/23a4a1fd/73c2b672.mp3
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JSON: https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/future-around-find-out-5737933/episodes/dead-as-a-dodo-maybe-not-colossal-s-beth-shapiro-on-the-science-of-de-extinction-and-moonshots
Duration seconds: 1992

## Resource

So, there are dire wolves living on Earth again. They were “de-extincted” by Colossal Biosciences. And today on the show their Chief Science Officer joins me to share her view on why the de-extinction matters — not as a science project, but because it will help solve problems that threaten every species on earth, including us. Beth Shapiro is the Chief Science Officer at Colossal Biosciences, and she helped to bring back the dire wolf or, as others call it, a gray wolf with 20 genetic edits. There is a fierce debate about what de-extinction even means, and we discuss that, but whatever you call them, there are now three big wolves living in an undisclosed location and they wouldn't be there if not for the DNA that Beth and her team edited. Colossal is also working to bring back the wooly mammoth, the Tasmanian tiger, the dodo and other animals that have long been extinct. Why? Listen to find out… Chapters: (01:19) - The Most Oprah Question Beth's Ever Been Asked (03:04) - Moonshots Require You to Create a Giant List of Problems (04:19) - The Things We’ll Solve Along the Way, a la the Original Moonshot… to the Moon (05:57) - Beth’s Journey: From Broadcast Journalism to Ancient DNA (09:13) - How a Sediment Core Solved a Mammoth Mystery (11:36) - Why Charismatic Animals Matter (a.k.a. Why Riz Is Everything) (12:38) - What’s Up With Romulus, Remus, and Khaleesi? (14:19) - But Are They Really “Dire Wolves”? The Controversy Over 20 Genetic Edits (21:45) - Should We Do This? Beth's Ethics Framework for Builders (23:51) - Advice for Moonshot Builders (25:10) - Why We Want Dodos, Mammoths, and Thylacines Back Links & Resources: Colossal Biosciences Beth Shapiro PopTech -- a conference I love! Support Future Around & Find Out Follow Dan on LinkedIn Get the free Future Ar…

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