# The Impact Leadership Has In The Growth of Experimentation ft. Lukas Vermeer

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/from-a-to-b-6398785/the-impact-leadership-has-in-the-growth-of-experimentation-ft-lukas-vermeer
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/from-a-to-b-6398785/the-impact-leadership-has-in-the-growth-of-experimentation-ft-lukas-vermeer.md
Podcast: [From A to B](https://stenobird.com/podcast/from-a-to-b-6398785)
Published: 2025-04-09T01:00:00+00:00
Episode link: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/from-a-to-b/episodes/The-Impact-Leadership-Has-In-The-Growth-of-Experimentation-ft--Lukas-Vermeer-e3155fd
Audio file: https://anchor.fm/s/e25e3fac/podcast/play/100881325/https%3A%2F%2Fd3ctxlq1ktw2nl.cloudfront.net%2Fstaging%2F2025-3-5%2F8b9ae083-60fb-0966-c6f7-667fdbedc12f.mp3
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JSON: https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/from-a-to-b-6398785/episodes/the-impact-leadership-has-in-the-growth-of-experimentation-ft-lukas-vermeer
Duration seconds: 3454

## Resource

What REALLY is the impact of leadership in growing an experimentation? And is "stable leadership" something which may actually be messing up your ability to grow your program? This was something I wanted to enlist the thoughts from the "Taco King" himself, Lukas Vermeer. We went into some great thoughts and conversations around building trust, being perceived as a credible person to help you grow your experimentation program, and other important things related to leadership and experimentation. We got into: - How Lukas REALLY built anti-fragile experimentation at Booking.com (and how some parts MAY have been influenced by the ... Dutch Mafia?!) - The impacts of working from home to building and scaling experimentation (spoiler: it DOES make shit harder) - "Trust" and "Credibility" are two VERY important things in growing experimentation - how you actually GET those, well Lukas and Shiva have thoughts Timestamps: 00:00 Episode Start 3:02 The Leadership at Booking.com (and how it WAS stable) 8:57 Which Impacts Experimentation More? Stability or Trust? 14:54 The Impact of Working From Home to Growing an Experimentation Program 24:39 Making Experimentation Anti-Fragile (Along With A Fun Lukas Story About It) 40:20 What CAN CRO Do When Leadership is Unstable 47:29 How to be Credible Without Being Annoying 51:03 “PREACH” : Manuel De Costa Go follow Lukas on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lukasvermeer/ And go follow Manuel on LinkedIn as well! https://www.linkedin.com/in/manueldacosta/ Also go follow Shiva on LinkedIn: ⁠⁠⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/shiva-manjunath/⁠ If you like this content, go nominate us for a community award at: https://experimentationcultureawards.com/ Subscribe to our newsletter for more memes, clips, and a…

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