# Challenger Cities EP89: To Do, Not Just Be with Gil Penalosa

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/challenger-cities-6959558/challenger-cities-ep89-to-do-not-just-be-with-gil-penalosa
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/challenger-cities-6959558/challenger-cities-ep89-to-do-not-just-be-with-gil-penalosa.md
Podcast: [Challenger Cities](https://stenobird.com/podcast/challenger-cities-6959558)
Published: 2026-06-25T14:56:28+00:00
Episode link: https://rss.com/podcasts/challengercitytoronto/2943139
Audio file: https://content.rss.com/episodes/278784/2943139/challengercitytoronto/2026_06_25_14_54_04_5f8d56a4-69b9-454e-af8f-d40e0d141364.mp3
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JSON: https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/challenger-cities-6959558/episodes/challenger-cities-ep89-to-do-not-just-be-with-gil-penalosa
Duration seconds: 5677

## Resource

This episode is a zinger. Because Gil Penalosa came in ready to talk! He doesn't hold back as he discussed the issues with Toronto municipal projects, where the city could be amazing but is often found lacking in ambition. We explore ideas from the absolute basics of providing space to walk, why we might want to reframe the idea of the NIMBY to the one of the CAVE person - Citizens Against Virtually Everything!, and how rather than debating an idea to death ... maybe we just try it and see what happens. As Toronto comes up to the mayoral election, Brad Bradford or Olivia Chow might actually want to pay some attention.

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## Transcript

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