# Ep. 161: Shangri-La 2025; 3.5% of GDP on defence?

Page: https://stenobird.com/podcast/australia-in-the-world-335013/ep-161-shangri-la-2025-3-5-of-gdp-on-defence
Text version: https://stenobird.com/podcast/australia-in-the-world-335013/ep-161-shangri-la-2025-3-5-of-gdp-on-defence.md
Podcast: [Australia in the World](https://stenobird.com/podcast/australia-in-the-world-335013)
Published: 2025-06-06T20:00:00+00:00
Episode link: https://australiaintheworld.podbean.com/e/ep-161-shangri-la-2025-35-of-gdp-on-defence/
Audio file: https://mcdn.podbean.com/mf/web/7pv3xkk6f9p2rhjt/AITW_ep_161.mp3
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JSON: https://stenobird.com/v1/public/podcasts/australia-in-the-world-335013/episodes/ep-161-shangri-la-2025-3-5-of-gdp-on-defence
Duration seconds: 1575

## Resource

The annual Shangri-La Dialogue took place in Singapore from 30 May to 1 June. Zack Cooper of the American Enterprise Institute attended and returns to the podcast to talk through his impressions with Darren. What did we learn about the Trump administration’s strategy in Asia? Should the region fear abandonment or entrapment more? And what should we make of Secretary of Defense Hegseth’s call for Australia to spend 3.5% of GDP on defence? Australia in the World is written, hosted, and produced by Darren Lim, with research and editing this episode by Hannah Nelson and theme music composed by Rory Stenning. Relevant links Remarks by Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth at the 2025 Shangri-La Dialogue in Singapore (As Delivered), 31 May 2025: https://www.defense.gov/News/Speeches/Speech/Article/4202494/remarks-by-secretary-of-defense-pete-hegseth-at-the-2025-shangri-la-dialogue-in/ Huw McKay, “Trump and the art of the (bad faith) deal”, “Lowy Interpreter, 2 June 2025. Stacie E. Goddard, “The Rise and Fall of Great-Power Competition: Trump’s New Spheres of Influence”, Foreign Affairs, May/June 2025: https://www.foreignaffairs.com/united-states/rise-and-fall-great-power-competition# Net Assessment (podcast), “Great Power Competition or Collusion?”, 29 May 2025: https://www.stimson.org/2025/great-power-competition-or-collusion/

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